Interviewee: Dorothy Hunt

Catalogue Number: GRCA 63389

Date of Interview: May 29, 1994

Place: Albright Training Center, Grand Canyon, Arizona

Interviewer: Juti Winchester

Editor: Carolyn Richard, Museum Curator

Winchester: This is Juti Winchester. I'm interviewing Dorothy Hunt for Grand Canyon National Park on, I can't even remember the date [May 29, 1994], for the [75th Anniversary] Reunion, and we're in the Albright Training Center. You worked for Fred Harvey?

Hunt: I worked for Fred Harvey on the rim: Bright Angel Lodge and also the El Tovar occasionally. And I was started as a waitress and graduated to bartender in the cocktail lounge. I lived up here from 1946 to [1968]. The reason we [came] here was my husband was a conductor on the Santa Fe. He: bid on the job of the train when they used to come up everyday to the canyon and bring the people. And the Bright Angel Lodge knew I had waitressed a little bit, they needed help, so they came to me and asked me if I would work. I told them yes. So I went to work as a waitress. And then I had tended bar before that, so [when] they needed a bartender, [I changed]. This was during the war years and all the men were in the service, so I tended bar. Waited on many, many interesting people: tourists, plus the people we worked with, plus the Park Service, plus the clientele from the managers [on down]. Had a great time. Loved every minute of it.

Winchester: So how old were you when first got here?

Hunt: Oh dear, tell my age. I probably was [twenty-nine years]. Heavens. And of course, anyone that understands the Santa Fe, the crews would get bumped due to a seniority basis. And we'd get bumped and we'd go back to Winslow. Then as soon as we [had bump], we came back to the canyon. When we first came, [we] lived in a room in the Bright Angel Lodge, my husband and I. [When I went to work,] then the head housekeeper wouldn't let anyone wearing a uniform of the Bright Angel dining room be seen coming out of the lodge. She complained to the manager. So we moved into the Brown building. Then we left there and went back to Winslow, was bumped, and when we [bumped] back we had got a house on Avenue B. We [were] bumped again and we came back and had a house on Avenue A. And then the last year I was here, I had a son who was to be born who is an adopted child, and my husband got bumped just before the end of the season and I moved into the girls' dormitory. So I've lived up here everyplace but the El Tovar. [Dorothy had one day off a week. Her husband had no days off. He would go with the train back to Williams, stay in Williams for the night, and then come with the train back to the Canyon the next morning. He slept during the day here at the canyon.]

Winchester: So how did the people at the canyon, the other employees, treat Fred Harvey employees?

Hunt: They were great. We all worked as a big crew. There was really no animosity. Everybody accepted everybody. Everybody did their job. Of course, it was very well controlled at that time. I was a married woman, but the girls that were here, they had regulations that they were supposed to stick to, and they did. And it worked out very well. The managers were great. I worked :for Mr. Kennedy who was here at the time. He was the manager of the Bright Angel Lodge. When he retired, Mr. Snow, who was the assistant

manager, became manager. And then he retired. And Mr. Draper, who was the assistant manager, became manager. And I was here when Mr. Draper passed away. I can not remember the year. It was in the sixties sometime, not too long before we left and moved back to Winslow.

Winchester: On your spare time, did you use the Grand Canyon for recreational purposes?

Hunt: Yes, like everybody up here, we went out to Rowe Well, we went out to Tusayan, and we set along the rim at night and. just watched the moon and the clouds and everything over the canyon. That was the best time. I loved doing that and I still do.

Winchester: You appreciated where you were.

Hunt: I appreciated where we were. We spent several really cold winters here when the snow was about three feet deep. And it was just beautiful. We loved it. We stayed just as much as we could.

Winchester: Did you ever visit the North Rim?

Hunt: I've been just to the rim is all. I've been down in the canyon three times. I walked down the Bright Angel Trail the first time. And I've been down to Phantom Ranch twice. I didn't have enough courage to ride the mule, it's too high up off the ground. My husband and I both walked down and stayed at Phantom Ranch two nights -- twice. It was beautiful.

Winchester: What's your best memory?

Hunt: I think the best memory is the canyon itself. I don't think you can beat it. I've lived many places. And the canyon is the nicest place that I've ever lived. I think that's the best memory as far as that part goes. I have lots of memories of incidents that happened here, that were good memories. But the canyon itself is the memory. And today, as I came in from Winslow and I drove up 180 through Flagstaff, it's just a road. When I got to the road that it meets to come up here to the canyon, there was something came over me, and as many times as I've been on this road, and I thought I'm just almost there. And it was just kind of a peaceful feeling. It was a little bit strange, but very very nice because of all the memories I have up here. I might say that past April the fifth I lost my husband with a heart attack and it just brought back lots of memories of our living here.

Winchester: This is the first time you've been back since then.

Hunt: Since his passing, yes. I've been back many, many times. Come every chance I get. I come to all the Fred Harvey reunions.

Winchester: Can you tell me about some of the people? You said you

served interesting people in the bar?

Hunt: And in the dining room also. I many times have served Barry Goldwater and Daggot and Harvey. They used to ask for me to serve them. Then we had the time that, when I first came up we had a French chef whose name was Marcel Phardough and he did beautiful ice carvings. I was one of, who served the special banquets. We'd have these beautiful ice carvings and whole pigs roasted and this sort of thing. It was just such a gorgeous way that they put on everything. And the Harveys, and all the dignitaries. They used to have the Elks' conventions up here, and the Shiners'. We would do special things for them also, which was very interesting.

Winchester: You could serve the food with pride.

Hunt: Yes, pride, because everything was made so beautifully and displayed beautifully on the table. I was real upset the last time I was in the Bright Angel. They [have] all these old wooden tables and the counter's gone and everything we used to have -- the linen tablecloths and the napkins and the crystal water jugs. You go in there now and it just looks like McDonalds. I'm very upset at it.

Winchester: What dishes that were served stayed in your mind? Or is there anything that was your special favorite?

Hunt: No . . . I can't think of a favorite. You mean as far that I served to the people? They used to serve a very nice steak. Their salads were always very, very good. Their pastries and bread were homemade, down in the oven underneath of the El Tovar. They were all made right here.

Winchester: Have you been to the El Tovar?

Hunt: Not this time.

Winchester: Not since . . . not for awhile?

Hunt: Oh, it's been a couple of years.

Winchester: I was wondering how it compared.

Hunt: They don't have the baker anymore. Everything is brought in. They don't do the ice carvings anymore, and they don't do several of the things that were really, really special at that time.

Winchester: Do you think the quality is what it used to be?

Hunt: I haven't eaten in the Bright Angel or the El Tovar since I left here so I really couldn't comment on that, but I know the service is not up to what it was.

Winchester: Do you have a favorite story of something that happened while you were working?

Hunt: Do you want a funny story?

Winchester: A funny story would be good.

Hunt: Tourists ask strange questions. One time I was working in the bar, the bar used to be just a service bar out of the kitchen before they built the cocktail lounge and that was the booths. There were booths up there on the far end and overlooking the canyon. We had an ice plant here and we had a big whistle that blew every morning at eight and at five o'clock. I had just served [this couple] a drink, and this whistle went off and it used to just resound in the canyon. This man looked at the lady and said, "What is that?" I said, "Oh, that's the last boat down the canyon." "Oh! We've got to see that," and they got up -- and the dining room was full, it was dinner time -- they ran clear through the dining room, out the front door. I watched them lean over the edge of the canyon trying to see the boat. They kind of stood back up, they looked at one another very demurely, walked back in and sat down and finished their drinks and went on their way. They never said a word. But we were awful sometimes. We made up all kinds of stories.

Winchester: That's pretty good. What kind of people did your fellow employees tend to be?

Hunt: I found them all very honest. At the time, what little time that I stayed in the girls' dormitory, when my husband would be sent [to Winslow,] well, several times, right at the end of the season -- you know they had a season where most of the girls from the east would go back home for the winter -- and they'd ask me to stay. My husband would get bumped back to Winslow, and they'd ask me to stay and finish out the season. So I'd move in to the girls' dormitory. Very honest, very helpful, they helped one another, they did things for people if you were ill.

Going back to the memorial thing, I think I better tell you the best thing that ever happened to me up here. As I mentioned, we were adopting a baby. They used to call me sometimes if they'd get a special tour in and they'd call me to come down and work special. I wore a squaw dress with my Indian jewelry and things in the bar. One day one of the girls came running up there and said, "Dorothy, you're needed down at the B.A. [Bright Angel] right away. " So I threw my squaw dress on and I hurried down there. I ran into the bar and there were only two or three people sitting there and the bartender. I looked around and I

thought, "What do they need me for?" The bartender said, "Oh, they want you in the dining room. " And I thought, "Dining room?" I hadn't worked the dining room in a long time. So I walked into the dining room, and you know the coffee shop, and then there's what we called the porch? I looked over and here's this porch just completely full of people and I thought, "Oh, we're going to have a special party." Then I stopped in my tracks and looked. There was everybody at the canyon in there, everybody I worked with, everybody I knew from over in the village, everybody from the El Tovar and I thought, "What's going on?" I walked through the door and they said, "Surprise! " and they gave me a baby shower.

Winchester: Oh my gosh!

Hunt: They had three big, long tables just stacked with gifts. One of the girls in the dormitory had made a great big stork and it was sitting by a big sheet cake, huge sheet cake, and on the cake said `Changing Times for Dorothy'. That was Mr. Snow's idea, he made up that saying for my cake. I think that was the neatest thing that happened to me.

Winchester: Was there anything you didn't like about living up here?

Hunt: Only the snowy roads. When I would have to go back home and take care of things, and driving along the ice and snow. That was all. I loved every minute of it. We used to have the deer come right up to our back door. They came up to the coffee shop and get in the garbage can. The squirrels of course, they were always along the rim.

Winchester: Have the kinds of tourists changed?

Hunt: Well . . . yes, I'm sure they have. Like I say, I haven't been up here enough to know what there is now. We had a lot of foreign tourists at that time and the big conventions and things would come up, but not nearly as many people. I couldn't believe when I drove in today, the cars that are parked up and down the streets! We used to just park in front of the B.A. [Bright Angel Lodge] There was always a spot.

Winchester: I couldn't tell you what the visitors are now, it's in the millions.

Hunt: It's just unreal! When I came through the gate out here, it took me almost eighteen minutes to go through that gate and there were three lines of us! So, it's really different than what it was when I was up here.

Winchester: What was Grand Canyon village like when you were here?

Hunt: It was just Avenue A and Avenue B. That was it. They had the mule barn, they had the cowboys' dormitory, they had the campground over there and the cafeteria over at the campground. Avenue A and Avenue B were paved. I don't remember how many homes were along that, but that was the only houses up here with the exceptions of a couple that were built for some of the managers. They had the railroad station and the railroad agent lived above the station. And the El Tovar and the Brown Building [the Brown Building was

for marrieds], the girls' dormitory, and the Bright Angel Lodge and that was all that was right here in the village. Oh, they had a garage and a service station and offices down across from the depot. [There was also a small hospital with doctor.]

Winchester: Where did you shop for groceries?

Hunt: Mostly in Winslow, in Flagstaff. They had Babbitts Brothers, I forgot to mention Babbitts. They had Babbitts here, but when I would go home I'd usually bring back most of my [food]. Of course, being by myself most of the time, my husband being gone on the train, I didn't do a whole lot of cooking. Used to eat most of my meals at the Bright Angel.

Winchester: Do you remember any big events or developments that happened while you were here? A presidential visit or something like that?

Hunt: Oh, well, yes. The vice-president was here one time, I remember that. I don't know what year. And all the governors and senators in Arizona used to come up periodically. Like I say, Senator Goldwater just loved it up here and he was always up here. Easter morning, right west of the Bright Angel Lodge, they always had an Easter Sunrise Service to watch the sun come up over the canyon. That was a big event. But I don't know of any real changes that occurred while I was here.

Winchester: Did you get to hear the teachers' college choir, the Shrine of the Ages choir?

Hunt: Oh yes, many times. I understand now they hold it down there in the building somewhere, but this was right along the rim there at the Bright Angel Lodge and it was just fantastic!

Winchester: What's the biggest change that you've noticed since you've been here?

Hunt: The growth in the people. The growth of the houses and the homes. When I was up here, they weren't allowed to build the homes. See all these houses that were built in here belonged to the Santa Fe. Of course, there was housing for the Park Service and that was government, I guess. But as far as Fred Harvey, they had the boys' dorm and the girls' dorm and then the cowboy dorm. It's the growth. It's just amazing what the change is. When you come to a place that was as small as it was when I lived here and you can't find your way around, you have a problem. They've changed the roads where they come in to the rim. See the old road coming in from Williams used to come right up to the El Tovar, right at the end of the depot. Now it comes way out on the rim and comes over. Of course, Babbitts has their shopping center over there. That wasn't there. It's just completely changed. They've got one way streets, which I can't believe, at Grand Canyon.

Winchester: Yeah, it can be quite a chore getting around up by the El Tovar.

Hunt: Right!

Winchester: You got lots of pretty views up there. What do you think the goals were for the Grand Canyon? I mean, how did you see the goals?

Hunt: The goal was to treat everyone with the best service and interest that they could. Everyone went out of their way to answer all the questions and be the nicest they could to the tourists and welcome them back. It was just a different service than it is today, and I'm not speaking of just the canyon -- everywhere! They don't [give] the same kind of service anywhere that they used to. When you waited on a party, you gave that party your full attention till they were completely taken care of. You didn't go take their order, come back and slam it down in front of them, throw a check at them and leave and never come back to see if they wanted water, coffee or what have you. That's the way it goes today. You can't get a waitress' eye, or a waiter, to get something else.

Winchester: Did you ever work at the Fred Harvey House in Winslow?

Hunt: Yes, I tended bar at the [Bullring Bar upstairs at the diningroom.]

Winchester: Did you like that?

Hunt: Yes. I did that all the times when we were bumped and had to go back to Winslow. That's a beautiful place. Right now, [the] city of Winslow is on the verge of buying it. They're going to refurbish it and it's going to be a beautiful tourist stop. It's a beautiful building.

Winchester: That's what I understand.

Hunt: I also knew Mary Jane Colter. I waited on her many times. She used to come up every once in a while, she'd have to come up and look things over.

Winchester: Do you have any outstanding memories of her?

Hunt: No, other than she was very quiet and she was very particular. She wanted things set just a certain way. And not much conversation out of her. She would speak and greet you but that was about it, and thank you.

Winchester: Now, I think, didn't she decorate the La Posada?

Hunt: She was the whole thing. And up here too. By the time I was waiting on her, she was getting old.

Winchester: How did you feel about the Fred Harvey system, the corporation, being sold?

Hunt: I thought it was a dirty shame. I don't know why they wanted to let all these beautiful places just stand and rot away. I realize that there's progress and part of it was due to the Santa Fe being sold to the government, which was a mistake as far as I'm concerned. I mean, the passenger cars, you know., I mean passenger trains were sold to the government and that meant, I guess, they didn't work with Fred Harvey on keeping their stations open, is what I understand. And that part is, well, that's just past history. My husband used to say that was progress, but I don't know whether that was progress or not. I think that's regress. Now the government is talking about taking all passenger trains off the railroad. That was in the paper just the other day.

Winchester: Why?

Hunt: Because they're having so many wrecks. See, they won't maintain it, won't maintain the tracks and having all these tragic wrecks.

END Tape 1 Side A

BEGIN Tape 1 Side B

Winchester: Would you do it all again?

Hunt: I would if I was younger. I couldn't do it now. I couldn't work like I did. We carried those trays which were about four feet around and they were metal trays and we carried them full of dishes. We used to weave in and out of those tables with those things up in the air. I couldn't do that again.

Winchester: And that's china too!

Hunt: Oh yes, china. Beautiful china. Not some of this light weight whatever it's made out of, chalk I think. I don't think it's china at all, I think it's chalk!

Winchester: What did it look like?

Hunt: It had a blue, a little blue pattern on it, kind of a dainty pattern. And everything matched, everything had to match. You couldn't put anything ... your silverware was put just so and your napkin was folded just so. And, like I say, they had the crystal water bottles and they were on the table. You brought the water and the ice and then they could refill their own glass. We always had a break between breakfast and lunch. We had to wash all those bottles and all the ashtrays and all the sugar bowls and all the salts and peppers to get them ready for lunch. [They closed at 11 a.m. and had an hour to do this cleaning and refilling. They were not allowed to do the refilling in front of the customers. Then they reopened at 12:00 noon and stayed open until closing time after dinner.]

Winchester: A lot of work.

Hunt: Of course, each person did their own station. We had so many tables in the station.

[Each waitress had four tables - 2 deuces (two person) and 2 fours (four person). Two waitresses serving four tables each would share one station where supplies like the linen napkins were kept. They did not use tablecloths. There were busboys and busgirls to service the tables. Many were Navajos, just a few were Hopi. ]

Winchester: What was your uniform. like? You mentioned the squaw dress.

Hunt: The squaw dress was what I wore in the cocktail lounge. It was just a cotton dress made like the Indian squaw dress. Then I wore my Indian jewelry with it. But the uniform in the coffee shop was just a white two-piece uniform with a little black tie and a name plate on it. It was a long sleeve. No short sleeves, and not knee length either. They were down to calf length. And white shoes.

Winchester: Very proper.

Hunt: Yes, very proper. If you had an accident and really soiled your uniform, someone would take over your station and you. went and changed your uniform to come back and finish your shift. Might tell you another little story: I told you about the baby shower that they gave for me when my son was born. Three months after he was born I brought him back up here to show him to everybody. When I came up, Mr. Snow wouldn't let me pay for the room. He put me in one of the B.A. rooms and they wouldn't let me pay for any of my meals. They threw a party for me. I had a friend with me and we showed the baby off. That's how nice they were. They treated you very, very nice, if you did your job. Of course if you didn't do your job, it wasn't very long till you were gone. But if you worked and did your job, then they were, I would say, extra nice. And the Harveys used to come up, oh, two or three times a year. They were very, very nice to everyone. Very pleasant to wait on.

Winchester: Is there any one in the family that's still left, that you know of?

Hunt: I don't really know. I haven't asked anyone. I think Daggot might be. He used to come up here quite often. I don't really know whether there's any left or not. There's some sons left, I know, but ... .

Winchester: Did you make any friends here that you still stay in contact with?

Hunt: Oh yes. Down there when I came up here, I was talking to about fifteen of them. All Harvey girls.

Winchester: So, there's fifteen Harvey girls here.

Hunt: More than that. Some of them I didn't know. They worked before I did. Some of them worked after I left. See, it's been thirty-five years since I was up here.

Winchester: Do you think the girls that work here now could be called ‘Harvey Girls’ the same way you were?

Hunt: That's a sticky question. I don't really know. I don't know any of them, haven't watched them work. I know they don't have the uniforms and the things that we used to have, but I don't know.

Winchester: Same name, different company almost.

Hunt: It's like it's being run by a different company.

Winchester: Do you have any more stories of ... can you think of anything else that happened, that sticks in your mind?

Hunt: I don't think of anything right at the moment. We all used to go out and dance at Tusayan. They had live music and a dance floor out there. That was recreation. Also, at the Bright Angel in the summertime they had a band, Cowboy Band. They were the cowboys with the mules. They played music right there at the Bright Angel Lodge. Where they have their little museum room now, that was a dance floor and they danced. They did that for the tourists every night. Of course, we could go too if we wanted to. It was very interesting. It only lasted a couple of hours, but very nice.

Winchester: What bands? Any famous bands come up?

Hunt: No, no famous bands. The [musicians] were the mule skinners, the ones that took the mules down and they played violin, or a banjo, or a guitar, or something else. [See oral history interview with Slim Kite, a member of the Cowboy Band.]

Winchester: Were they good?

Hunt: They were good! Just old western, old fashioned western type music. The tourists loved it. So many of the foreigners had never seen anything like that. Because there wasn't this much, like there is on TV now. Course I'm talking about when we first came up here, it was before TV. Now you see everything on TV [television]. At that time it was unusual.

Winchester: What you were there for.

Hunt: To entertain and take care of the guests.

Winchester: Was it part of your, not your job so much, but part of what you were doing to play up the western theme, the cowboys and Indians?

Hunt: They did to an extent because of the mule trip. And not everybody wanted to get on that mule and go down in the canyon, and that was part of it. But then Arizona has been

called ‘The West’ so this goes along with ‘The West’, you see. These easterners had no idea what the west was. Most of them came, would be their first trip through, they'd never been west, they'd stayed in the east.

Winchester: So you pit on ... ?

Hint: Yeah, we wore western shirts. The men always wore cowboy hats and boots and all those things.

Winchester: What did you think the first time you saw the Grand Canyon?

Hint: I was amazed. Course I saw the Grand Canyon a long time before I came up here to work. I saw it before I was married. We used to come up and go out to Rowe Well from Williams -- I lived in Williams two years -- we'd come up here and go to dances, they had western dances out there. We drove from Williams up to the dances on weekends. Bit I was just amazed, I had never seen anything really to compare it to before then. I was raised in California and I hadn't been in Arizona too long when I saw it for the first time.

Winchester: Have you been to any other National Parks (indecipherable)? Hunt: Oh yes, many. Seeing as how I've traveled quite a bit. Winchester: So, how do they compare?

Hunt: This is the best! I don't say that to ... Arizona even, has some real nice parks, bit this is the best.

Winchester: So does the canyon hold. a certain amount of magic for you?

Hunt: It does. Yes, very much so. And it always has from the first time I saw it. Winchester: What's your impression of the canyon itself? Do you still walk up and just ... ?

Hint: Yes, I do. I walk up and I have a very strong feeling. And I have never seen it look the same twice. That's what's amazing to me. You look one way and then the other way and you look across and it never looks the same, even though the temperature's the same, no wind, or there's snow, or whatever. It never looks the same. The shadows are always different.

Winchester: What's your favorite way to see it?

Hunt: Sit on the rim and watch it. I've never flown over it. Bit just to sit on the rim and watch it, watch as the sin goes down. I never was very good at getting up early enough to

see the sun come up, only on Easter. But to sit in the evening and just watch that sun go down and those shadows. We had beautiful sunsets here, you know, if there's any clouds and it's just gorgeous.

Winchester: What's your favorite place on the rim?

Hunt: I think right in front of the Bright Angel, that's where I spent most of my time. I've been to all the points but I never did really just go up and sit on them. I used to go out, we girls would go out when we'd get off work and just sit on the rim and watch it. And I wasn't alone, there was many of us.

Winchester: So, you think other employees appreciated it?

Hunt: Oh yes. I think most of them did. They would come back year after year after year. And really, it wasn't for the money. Waitresses today make lots of money. But in that time of day, you didn't make a whole lot of money, tips were really frugal. It wasn't the money. They came back because they loved the canyon. Originally those from the east were sent out here to work because they needed help. But once they spent a season, then they would come back the next year. The same girls, almost every year, the same girls would come. Once in a while one of them wouldn't come, but almost always the same girls would come back the next season.

Winchester: Did you enjoy the work itself?

Hunt: Yeah. I enjoyed it. I enjoy meeting people. I enjoyed every bit of it.

Winchester: Do you still have any active interests in the canyon now? Are you part of any groups?

Hunt: The Harvey Girls, I belong to the girl group. That's all. Course, like I say, the Santa Fe is not with the passenger service anymore, so there isn't anymore to that. But I'll be here next September for the Harvey Girl reunion, the Lord willing.

Winchester: Do you think the Santa Fe railroad had a large part in the development of the Grand Canyon?

Hunt: Oh yes! Because that was the way people could get up here and not take thirty-six hours to come on a wagon from Flagstaff.

Winchester: Thirty-six?

Hunt: It used to take about thirty-six hours to come on wagon from Flagstaff. And so when the railroad came in, that brought them up. Then of course, cars came along. Then it

evolved from that.

Winchester: Did you have to learn a lot of things about the Grand Canyon as part of your work?

Hunt: No, no. A lot of is read a lot about it bit it wasn't required. Because mainly all it was is . . . just look at it, you know. Didn't get too many technical questions about how it happened or anything like that. It was just ... they'd just go out and look at it. Some people would look and turn around and leave and some people would stand there all day and look. Depending on the person. Some people, it didn't impress at all -- just a hole in the ground, they said. And then other people were just awestruck.

Winchester: Were you here when they built the Shrine of the Ages building?

Hunt: No, they did that after I left. They were in the process of

doing it when I [left].

Winchester: Did you hear what people were saying about that?

Hunt: They were all enthused about it. Bit, like I think I mentioned a while ago, when they started holding their Easter services down there instead of on the rim, I think they ruined the services. Because that's in a building and otherwise you stood right on the rim and you watched all those shadows and clouds come in while they were singing and having their little speech. Howard Pyle used to come up and make a speech. Year after year, he was up here. He was governor of Arizona.

Winchester: Was it the same speech every year or was it a different . . . ?

Hunt: Oh, a different speech. But he used to come up and give the speech. Towards the end, before we left, it was someone else. I can't remember all who did come. They always had someone like that. Barry Goldwater came many, many times to the Easter service.

Winchester: He's supposed to be here this weekend.

Hunt: Oh is he?

Winchester: That's what I understand.

Hunt: I'll be darned! I haven't seen him for years.

Winchester: (indecipherable)

Hunt: Well, great! I hope he does too! He was great to wait on. A very pleasant man.

Winchester: Do you have any final things you want the world to remember about the Grand